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Codename Entertainment
[Critic] Infos, Pricing + VIP Rework

22 Posts
Link to post - Posted November 3rd 2014 at 6:03 AM
Exportforce
Hello,

as already mentioned in the alpha forums, it looks promising, but sadly the pricing/vip is out of hand...

About the infos: You should still give the char info screen instantly to the player, as some skills require infos from that window, as you don't know how much e.g. 10% INT/STR/DEX are. Just one example. Also the infos on everything that costs real money is not enough. When I click the Respecc button all I get is a payment window, telling me to buy shardium. But not how much I would need for the respecc.

Next is VIP. I know where you "copied" some things incl. the VIP but I must say that said VIP is way to heavy. Making you pay $10 (it's not that much but almost as much as a full fledged mmo sub) and makes you imbalanced fast against normal players, as you can skip every cooldown but on top of that you also have limited stamina.

So here is my idea of a reworked VIP:
1. Not permanently instant cooldowns. But for that 2 free cooldown skips per day
2. 15% faster cooldown on every building
3. 10% more All-Ressources (EXP, Gold, Lumber, etc) from all ingame sources
4. All inventory storage is usable
5. If you HAVE to use this stamina thing, give them 100 Stamina extra

That rework gives the VIP players a big advancement, but in a far more balanced way.

Also please rethink the stamina feature, as this is just a way of "Play X missions and then go away". If you try to "buy" some time to make progress on the new features of the game, better make players level slower instead of forbid them to play.

Iventory: You should make, at least, the first page a procedually opening spot. So players can aquire one page by playing the game. Maybe like every 10 Levels one row.
As you don't tell us what a row costs in money, I can go onto that topic. But also here I'd advise to make it possible to get them ingame. Not easy of course. But for example as a rare reward for hard end game missions.

That said, keep in mind, that players not always have big pockets of money to throw at you, so don't hinder them or disadvantage them by a big scale. Make it possible for them, to gain some advantages, too. As mentioned on the inventory, don't make it easy. But give loyal players a candy here and there. Like VIP for a day every 2-4 weeks for such. So they get a bit candy and to be able to keep up at least a bit.
So make it possible to gain e.g. a full respecc for a consecutive playing of 30 days or such. Keep your loyal players at your side.

If you have any questions about my thoughts, I'll gladly answer them.
Would like to go more indeep but as you don't tell any prices and such, I sadly can't.

kind regards
Exportforce

232 Posts
Link to post - Posted November 3rd 2014 at 7:45 AM
Andaho
My input to this subject is... watch this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mhz9OXy86a0

I started writing more in this post, but then I have deleted it, because basically, the whole argument is summed up in that video.

886 Posts
Link to post - Posted November 3rd 2014 at 12:14 PM
David Whittaker (CNE Dev)
Hi Expertforce,

We are as per the message on the VIP dialog still working on what we will include in the VIP package. More resource drops are certainly something we are discussing. Availably inventory is more complicated because when your VIP expires that inventory would have to be not available to use, otherwise it is exploitable. Full cooldown removal is VIP's biggest benefit, really where you get the value for your purchase, so is not likely something we would remove.

I am not sure what you are saying here:

"as you can skip every cooldown but on top of that you also have limited stamina."

Sounds like you might have been trying to say *unlimited* stamina (otherwise the sentence doesn't flow right) - but that is not the case. VIP does not provide any additional stamina.

In regards to stamina we have to carefully balance how much content we allow players to consume with how much we can create in a timely fashion. For the first few months as we build up content we may be tighter with stamina so that players don't burn through everything too quickly and become bored. Obviously we don't want there to be too little available either, but it is a tricky balance. We have a long list of max level content we will be releasing over the coming weeks that should help a lot with that.

14 Posts
Link to post - Posted November 3rd 2014 at 1:09 PM
Blotto
" Full cooldown removal is VIP's biggest benefit, really where you get the value for your purchase, so is not likely something we would remove."
so vip is only maximized while you are leveling and capped players wont have a reason to use it?
why not 400 shardium a month thrown in? and a free limited edition cloths for players who have paid ahead for a 3-6 months sub to it?

22 Posts
Link to post - Posted November 3rd 2014 at 1:09 PM
Exportforce
Hi,

thanks for the response!

Inventory: There are 2 ways to use it, I know both versions being used in other games.
1. Just block everything, except mandatory Items like Quest Items or Bought VIP stuff.
2. (Better Version) You lose the capability to put stuff into the inventory, but still can take out stuff. You HAVE to move the full stack on a field to a "free" space to use/unstack it. Yes, a player then could use a 24h token to full spam his inventory, but he wouldn't have such a big bonus out of it.

Cooldown + Stamina
I did write what I meant, but being not a native english speaking user could create some misunderstanding, so sorry if there are some.
It's the thing you point out yourself... On the one hand, you give a player the ability to skip everything but on the other hand you block them with stamina.

Thats why I made the suggestion without having a full-skip everthing.

886 Posts
Link to post - Posted November 3rd 2014 at 2:30 PM
David Whittaker (CNE Dev)
Hi Blotto,

VIP will have other benefits, once we have worked out what they are going to be. Cooldown removal is a big part of VIP so it follows to absolutely get the maximum value out of it you would want to use it on buildings. But it removes cooldowns on things like arena battles, university upgrades, etc. So in addition to anything we add to it maxed players will still have cooldowns to remove.

Hi Expertforce,

The inventory thing is certainly something we can consider, but it does feel a little clunky to leave items in a locked state. It isn't clear to me if you are saying the VIP cooldowns are too powerful for the price, or not powerful enough. It sounds like you are saying that is too powerful, but the limited stamina does limit the overall benefit you can gain from not having other cooldowns.

22 Posts
Link to post - Posted November 3rd 2014 at 3:04 PM
Exportforce
Hi,

version 1 is just a version I have seen already in a few games... It has its pros and cons. But version 2 is definitly something to keep pinging in your head, as it doesn't lock the items out. You just have to drag them back onto a usable space.

About the cooldowns: They are HEAVILY TOO POWERFULL. Highly OP.
I really do know that. I was a product manager on a game using it and was highly against that mechanic and the game also died on this mechanic, as non-vip players where totally at a no-competition level for the whole game. I know WT (I don't know if I may use the name of other games, thus just a shorty on this) uses it too and I was as test a VIP on my own there and there too, just way to op. sure, you limit everything via that stamina thing. But keep in mind, as this is not BW or EB but an RPG/Strategy mix, this is something players have had more than very bad experiences with, a lot of players will run away when they see such a feature.

A better approach is to make leveling slower.
I already saw a thread where people are on the current max level and I bet the opener's a vip. So it might be a better idea to give bigger building cooldowns as a slow down and give VIP, as mentioned, 15% off of those cooldowns. This way, they are faster then regular players but still in way you can handle with new content and such.

886 Posts
Link to post - Posted November 3rd 2014 at 6:39 PM
David Whittaker (CNE Dev)
Hi Exportforce,

I will think over the inventory thing as an option, but no promises.

I am not sure that I am seeing VIP quite as OP as you are. Stamina is the biggest leveling slowdown, you can only upgrade your buildings as far as your level, so VIP is effectively limited by stamina.

While there are players at max level, that is something we expected because currently we only have around 2 weeks worth of campaign play. With an extra days play costing around $5 in shardium, and less if you buy the starter packs it is very easy to play through the current campaign content. Having VIP only marginally helps you with that because it lets you upgrade your companions without waiting. But that is really the only major benefit it provides towards leveling.

As we add new campaign content the time to complete the campaign will get longer. However completing the campaign and leveling to max will never take a huge amount of time. It will be the content that unlocks when you are max level that will provide a lot of play time. Those features are not done yet, but we are working to get them in soon. Most of the max level features will be daily limited, and VIP does not remove any daily cooldowns.

So your concerns may be a little premature.

32 Posts
Link to post - Posted November 6th 2014 at 11:47 PM
VDBai
VIP doesn't make much of a difference now at all. Anyone who is claiming it to be overpowered hasn't spent enough time with the game.
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