Drizzle has an additional + 20% dps ability and you can put him in front of your main. But yes, the golden epic should be a bit more in my opinion

Artaxes epic roar gear blows Drizzle out of the water. Drizzle's golden epic should be +300% to compete with Artaxes.

I'm not trying to compete with artaxes. I know she is meant to use in conjunction with groklok, and that's fantastic. 187% on Eligible recievers for my dpser feels great (2 people in front) But when you have two crusaders with identical abilities, and the one with the golden epic is doing less than the one with the regular epic? It honestly feels pretty lame.

As I stated earlier, I have drizzle several rows ahead to make room for khouri and his koffee potion, which puts inspiring words to waste. It's not terribly efficient to do so, but it's what I have to do. And it doesn't matter which formation.

I'm a big fan of Groklok. And I like the idea of their syngergy. And I like Drizzle because I'm a big fan of the forgotten realms :P

However, with Groklok and drizzle in the grimm formation I do about 10% more dps than with groklok +Artaxes. And that is with 3 rares on Artaxes and rare/epic/golden epic on Drizzle. And that just feels weird.

I think the issue might be the tooth item on Groklok and how it works with the running play ability from Drizzle. With no tooth, drizzle's running play alone is boosting the ability from 150% to 300%, a 60% increase of power on the DPS row. With grokloks epic tooth the change is 300% to 450%. Which is only an increase of 37,5%.

Edit: numbers on the box formation and worlds wake are slightly different. with grokluk buffing 2 crusaders instead of 1. Tooth: +150%, increased to 225%. Running play is adding 25% dps. No tooth: 75% to 150%. an increase of 42,8%

The problem is not with the golden epic, but with the fact that the tooth item and running play ability are stacked additively instead of multiplicatively.

For me, the main issue between Artaxes and Drizzle is that they didn't put a Critical Click Chance talent on Drizzle, so even if Drizzle is equivalent or brings a little bit more dps than Artaxes at the moment, if you invest in the talent boosting Critical, Artaxes will keep getting better and better while Drizzle will stay the same.

@TheAngelicVixen, that is because the point you made has no sense. The two are different skills, with different numerical values. They are NOT the same skill. Drizzle's golden epic IS better than Khouri's epic, but it is applied to a skill that gives +20%, not 30% like Khouri's. Apples and oranges, dude...

Well, first of all, Drizzle's contribute to DPS is much greater than Khouri's, that is why the comparison makes little sense. As it makes little sense talking about Siri without considering all she contributes to a formation: she is not just a random golden epic carrier, she has an insane boosting skill for female crusaders (which is why Sarah is stronger than WW right now...) as well as a gold find bonus! I would use her even with a common item, the golden epic is just icing on the cake.
The only comparison that makes sense is the one between Drizzle and Lion, as they are mutually exclusive (keeping in mind that Drizzle is supposed to be used in conjunction with the Orc). And here Drizzle loses, albeit not by a large margin, but the devs have already said that they will change Drizzle's Running Play to be multiplicative in the next patch, which will make her stronger that Lion. And if you are underwhelmed by Groklok + Drizzle, you should really take a better look at them: with epic items (and golden epic on Drizzle), and a single crusader like Sarah in front of Groklok (something that is easy to achieve in Grimm's campaign) you are looking at a +1664% DPS boost, not exactly weak, I would say...

Thanks! I have tried multiple formations that people have posted and nothing beat mine until now. So, using Grok to buff Sarah in that single slot like you suggested did improve overall DPS, but even with Drizzle, Grok just didn't contribute much to DPS. So, I swapped drizzle with Artaxes and now Sarah is even more murderous. I can still achieve a higher DPS with my old formation if turkey is zapping Jim and Sarah, but this new one is more consistent.

Just to be clear, you CAN use turkey in Grimm's formation. I certainly do. I do not use Jim though, I have tried having multiple DPSer and it never worked out, much better to have a single one. And yes, until the next update Lion is slightly better than Drizzle, things will change in a few days though, because she will buff Groklok even more, and he is very strong (I even got lucky and got his epic item with the first jeweled chest I opened...).

Oh, just as a side note: yes, Groklok deals no damage. He is not supposed to do damage. Using him as a DPSer is absurd, he has the strongest buff in the game, and needs to be used as a buffer. Do not even level him up after he is lvl 75, and always put Drizzle ahead of him (note than, in order for Drizzle's skill to activate, she needs to be ahead, but not necessarily DIRECTLY ahead: she can be 2-3 rows in front of Groklok and still buff his Elegible Receivers skill)